Page 3 of 4
Re: Here's something to talk about!
Posted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 10:18 am
by DGLOBE69
IAM NOT SAYING EVERYTHING THAT THESE GUYS DO A WRONG BUT THEY DO SOME STUPID THINGS MAN,
WE HAD A COMVERSATION ABOUT THIS THE OTHER DAY, ABOUT WHAT GOIN ON IN D/CA. SOME PPLE ARE SAYING OH THING IN D/CA HAS NEVER BEEN BETTER, I DON'T KNOW IS IT JUST PARTY PARTISM GOING ON " WORKERS" SAYING THINGS BAD, OR IS THINGS REALLY BAD /ECONOMY/JOBS/HEALTHCARE/ECT.
CAUSE I DON'T WANT TO SOUND BIAS IN THIS SITUATION IAM NOT IN D/CA FOR THE PAST 4YRS.
Re: Here's something to talk about!
Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 4:45 pm
by club4g63
Subject: Chavez planning to build an oil refinery on Dominica
Dear Mr Wiltshire,
Today I am glad I got your email address. Miss Abigail of the DHTA gave me your phone number and when calling you where in a meeting I asked your email address.
My name is Claire Reyes and I live in The Netherlands. Just a few weeks ago while searching information about Dominica to go there on vacation I saw the announcement that president Chavez is going to build an oil refinery on Dominica. I myself was born and raised at Curaçao so I know what Dominica is about to loose. At that time on Curaçao you can say people didn't know better but now no government can hide behind ignorance. I started to send my personal story to international organizations hoping that someone can help Dominica. But I need feedback of the people of Dominica. Mr Steel of Beau Rive contacted the Dominica Hotel & Tourism Association and asked them to forward my email to all members.
What kind of (international) help do you have currently? How are people of Dominica dealing with this problem? Mr Wiltshire I really want to help so please get back to me.
I send you my personal story. Feel free to forward it to the opposition party or others that are interested (Mr Steele of Beau Rive told me he was going to forward my story to the press) but when people read it I want them to keep in mind that it isn't about me but about the future of Dominica.
Yours sincerely,
Claire Reyes
In my story I try to make it clear that what is going to happen on Dominica is not only about the environment. But no doubt that it will have a huge impact on the nature. From what I could find on the internet Dominica host many rare plant, animal and bird species and Dominica has also a rich ocean life. The government of Dominica says it will wait for the Environmental Impact Assessment report before starting to build the oil refinery but somewhere I suppose this is just being used for the formality.
I don't live on Dominica (island in the Caribbean, between Martinique and Guadeloupe). I understand that when you're living in a less developed country you desperately want things to change. So I understand that people need jobs to provide in their living but......I know what is to live on a small island with an oil refinery. I was born on Curaçao (Netherlands Antilles) and grew up viewing the oil refinery from the front door of our garden. I was lucky because when I was born we were living at the 'good' site of the island and most of the time playing around in our garden I didn't have to inhale the bad smoke. But a lot of people are living directly into the smoke. And when wind direction change during hurricane season (normally the wind on Curaçao is from the north-east) another part was having the effects of the smoke.. And it is really, really bad. Now writing this I can still 'feel', and taste the smoke, after so many years (I left Curaçao 22 years ago).
Why mine concerns with Dominica? Growing up with an oil refinery was the most normal thing for me but people of Dominica must not make that kind of mistake to let their children grew up like I did. They don't need to destroy their future, their culture, their legacy. With Curaçao, ok at that time you can say people didn't know better and they truly believed that the economy would get a boost. It happened till certain extents but the bad things that came with the oil refinery are to this day much more bigger.
Of course you have the environmental issues. The reason that not a great part of the ocean around Curaçao isn't polluted is because the oil refinery is located on land on the border of a large bay. But just one look at the bay at that part and you know that it isn't ok. The same for the land area. Dominica has not such bays at all. At this time they are talking about Castle Bruce (which is located in the Saint David parish) a place at the east coast. And at the northern area of this parish you will find the Carib territory. You will also find 'Morne Trois Pitons' national park, listed by UNESCO in 1997. For what I know the wind on Dominica comes mostly from the north-east. So a part of the national park will get polluted by the fumes and in the future many plants will die. The same with the sea. It will get polluted and not only concentrated at one part. Currents in the sea and wind can spoil the whole east coast. Dominica is also an island with a lot of rain and rivers. People get their drinking water from the rivers and those rivers are now pure. That will change too.
The fumes will effect the health of the people, will effect the farmers. The fallout will cover everything. My parents lived for 9 years in the smoke and my mother was continuously sick. She had nausea and headaches. I remembered also she used to tell that there was always a fine black dust in the house and clothes hanging outside to dry would also get a 'grey' layer.
When the oil refinery came to Curaçao the existing farming and fishing and small local handcraft making collapsed. Dominica is talking to make the island an self sustaining island and try to promote farming. With an oil refinery people will not want farm anymore. Probably they will earn more money but they will become very depended. When farming collapse everything need to be imported and so prices will rise. And not only with food products but it will effect prices of other goods. That's what happened at Curaçao and I do not see any reason why it's not going to happen on Dominica
Another issue is that Dominica will not have enough workers so a lot of people are going to be imported. Curaçao attracted workers from around the world. Mostly men alone and they were put together in barracks. Prostitution became a big business and with this also sexual diseases became a problem. Also a lot of problem with alcohol and crime.
The oil refinery also needed higher educated workers and these workers with their family were put in special build community's with almost no interaction with the locals. The locals of Curaçao were earning more money and yes maybe they could build a stone house, buy a fridge and some other items but because the prices kept climbing people in a certain way were still poor. With locals most of the time being the low paid workers and certain group of foreigners the high paid workers a social gap was growing. Other kind of business came also to Curaçao but again this was a group of foreigners like Chinese, Portuguese etc. And also what a lot of foreigners were doing was to send a great part of what they earned to their family's overseas.
My father was an imported worker from Colombia. He lived in the beginning with other men in barracks. He also send money to his family in Colombia and kept on doing this for a long time. He married my mother, a local and together they got seven children. My father came to work on the oil refinery to escape poverty and he did it but only, yes only trough education. My father has been working from his fourteen and came to Curaçao with no high education. He could read and write and while working at the oil refinery he followed a written course to become a technician paid with his own money and doing this in his spare time. He also learned the Dutch language and English so he could communicate better with the higher educated workers. At the end he wasn't a low paid worker anymore. But he was one of the few ones who got higher. He educated himself and it took a lot of time, a lot of hard working and perseverance to achieve another kind of live.
The Venezuela's president Chavez said last week that soon they can start construction of the oil refinery. The oil refinery on Curaçao is currently from Venezuela. It is old and need to be raised to standards of today. But the future is insecure because maybe it will close down. This is not the first time that Curaçao is looking at that dark cloud. It was the same when Shell decided to go away.
Chavez is promising Dominica that the environment will not be damaged and that the oil refinery will provide a lot of work. But I can't understand why Dominica. One of the most pristine places probably left. And just following Chavez his movements you know he has his own agenda. Maybe he doesn't want to keep the oil refinery on Curaçao and probably he wants to get more grip on the Caribbean islands. Because one thing is for sure Dominica will lost his independence completely with building the oil refinery. It will be a fake independence depending on the oil that is coming from Venezuela.
Now a days the economy of Curaçao is looking at the outside like a success story. But what a lot of people maybe don't know is that the reason it looks like that is of the big sister The Netherlands that keeps the island 'alive' by year after year pumping money into the economy. The Netherlands is also the only reason that Curaçao is not in the hands of Venezuela.
Curaçao want to stimulate tourism more, something that will be damaged on Dominica with an oil refinery and they can forget about Eco tourism what they currently are promoting.
So what are the problems of Curaçao today? Environmental and health issues directly caused by the oil refinery. A big part of Curaçao is being dominated by the view of the oil refinery. A huge social gap with a lot of really poor people. Crime rates are incredibly high for such a small island and a lot of drug related crimes. Illegal prostitution is another big problem, also HIV and AIDS and because Curaçao is officially a developed country it will not get compensation to get cheap AIDS medication. The unemployment is also extremely high. A lot of school dropouts and teenage pregnancy is still high.
And the good things? The price of the wealth of Curaçao is high, a fake wealth.
When I found out about the plans for building an oil refinery on Dominica it really hurt my heart. And the strange thing is that I do not know Dominica. I was just planning to visit this island with my family this summer. What I want is that somebody, some organization tell the Dominicans that there is another way to build their economy. Yes it will take time but it will be a solid base and not like Curaçao completely hollow out with all those negative problems. People of Dominica must keep their farming legacy, keep on educating their children and ask for another kind of help. Their are lot of organizations who can help. Dominica needs a plan for the future. Their government needs a 'business plan'. There are a lot of countries that are developing with the help of small, sustainable projects. They can develop tourism but again trying to achieve another kind of tourism and not let any company build big resources and secluding the locals of their own beaches.
I may be a pessimist because somewhere I think that Chavez will build that refinery. But still I hope that if people, organizations around the world get to know what is going to happen they can tell the people of Dominica that they can stand up and tell their government that there is another way. There are a lot of people that are willing to help with no interest at all and with no hidden agenda. I hope I can reach those people.Dominica needs to see the alternatives.
Yours sincerely,
Claire Reyes
this is a forwarded mail that i got so decided to share it with u guys
Re: Here's something to talk about!
Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 8:34 pm
by Preppy
nice of you to share. what do you think? you still want that thing built here?
Re: Here's something to talk about!
Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 11:04 pm
by djphattraxx
RUBBISH!!! and illl tell you why,
she say she was born in Curacao (Netherlands Antilles) and then 22 years later she left cause of the smoke smell etc, but she cant tell you what kind of refinery is going to be built on D/ca and/or how safe or unsafe it will be!! 22 years is along time for things to change or be different for what was there 22 years ago on Curaçao and i would think NOTHING could smell worse than the land fill in stock farm!!!.... they be times when it smelling so bad i have to roll up the windows when i drive past the port !! that was the past and this is the future i dont think we should condemn the oil refinery project before we know what it will do!
sorry i didnt read all of it i just skipped through it after the 2nd paragraph, to me she just making it sound worse that may not be! i mean ppl we talking about what she experienced more that 22 years ago .....things CAN change for the better!
and as for Mr. Chavez .......................Damn ASS!! (nuff said)
![cheers [cheers]](./images/smilies/drinks.gif)
Re: Here's something to talk about!
Posted: Mon Feb 18, 2008 11:15 pm
by djphattraxx
look at what an olr refinery and a Nu iol refinery looks like
Re: Here's something to talk about!
Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2008 11:58 am
by ceelos
http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/02/18/refine ... index.html
And if something goes wrong the effects are felt more than 40 miles away.... are we prepared for mistakes like that?
Re: Here's something to talk about!
Posted: Tue Feb 19, 2008 9:30 pm
by SF5
wow I didn't know that post reach so far, anyhow it is good to see people chiming in on a sensible discussion. I don't really care too much what politicians do, just that when they do their decisions have far reaching circumstances and the burden falls on the backs of the poor. The middle upper class go run, but the poor bare the brunt and is they themselves that should bare it cause is they who vote them in so I still don't feel sorry for them. but my heart goes out to the young and innoccent. Anyhow politicians in dominica and other developing countries are not held directly responsible for their actions. I will never vote. EVER!!!
On a final note remember Haiti, thats all I need to say remember haiti, the ppl who brought about the havoc no longer there.
Re: Here's something to talk about!
Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2008 7:46 am
by Evo-Man
Guys there is something more scary than the oil refinary.
Its the ALBA agreement, the implications of us signing this agreement. The intentions of the agreement are great BUT those who do not ant us to benefit from it have to power to turn our lights off.
Soon the info will be on the news look out for it.
Re: Here's something to talk about!
Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2008 7:57 am
by club4g63
we need to come together and pray i recomend 3 hail mary and 10 our father lol cause we in for a terible time .
Re: Here's something to talk about!
Posted: Wed Feb 20, 2008 5:33 pm
by Preppy
lol, I do not think that saying the rosary would even help. Ignorance is Bliss. Just wait till you start seeing deformed babies and water becoming unpure etc. and if a hurricane comes along just hope that a lightning dont hit it.